Posted on Wednesday 22nd of August 2007 at 13:02 in Linux

Why the Distrowatch chart counts

I recently postulated that PCLinuxOS was gaining more popularity than Ubuntu based on the feable metric of the Distrowatch "clicks per day" chart. I received lots of feedback insulting my use of this as metric so I felt it worth defending my decision.

The title of the post was "PCLinuxOS gaining more popularity than Ubuntu?" - a question to which I would discuss the answer. The important word is "popularity". Popularity doesn't mean "more people are using PCLOS than Ubuntu" because that doesn't tell the whole story; people talking/reading about it counts.

Explain
Well, if there are 8,000,000 people talking about Java yet only 500,000 using it whereas PHP has 1,000,000 people using it and 100,000 talking about it - which is more popular? If everyone is discussing Natalie Portman online but fewer people saw her latest film compared to no one discussing Paris Hilton online but lots of people buying her album (god forbid) then which is most popular?

My point is just because I'm saying PCLinuxOS is top of the distrowatch chart doesn't mean that I'm saying more people are using it than Ubuntu. It doesn't mean I'm saying it's better than Ubuntu.

The Distrowatch chart measures clicks, clicks portray popularity
If more people click on site A rather than site B, site A is more popular. Simple. More people reading about PCLinuxOS conveys an increased popularity - it's not a complicated concept.

I didn't use the term "usage statistics" or anything relating to it; therefore it seems folly to assume that's what I was attempting to explain. The point I was making was that PCLOS was above Ubuntu on the 3-months chart. I was not saying PCLOS has more users; just that it's newfound position in the chart portrays an increased level of interest that was not there before. Just thought I'd make myself clear.

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Showing most recent 20 of 23 comments [View all comments]

Here is my theory:

Ubuntu - a geek hobbyist distribution - Users - geek hobbyists

PClinuxOS - a Windows migrant distribution - Users - Windows migrants

No. of Windows migrants that log onto Distrowatch > No. of geek hobbyists that log onto Distrowatch

So now hits on PCLinuxOS webpage at Distrowatch > hits on Ubuntu webpage at Distrowatch - hence the result you see on the Distrowatch chart.

No one is tampering with anything (but I wish I have some data to back that up).

hounddog

PCLOS users are evangelical, pushing their distro to holywars - ’nuff said. The first page of their forums has an "I’m leaving" post from a 1k+ post member who dared mention mandriva and got his thread canned - part of their dogma. I see multiple complaints about heavyhanded moderation, and an implicit acceptance that the forum is for promotion, not discussion. All criticism blogs get mobbed by supporters, all polls get overwhelmed.

The above paragraph has nothing whatsoever to do with whether it’s a good distro or not - a question which I would need a few weeks to decide on.

My question - can’t I put my distro on top of the distrowatch charts automatically by simply making it the default firefox homepage on my install? I suspect the distrowatch site is the victim of a voluntary campaign, like the other polls - just need to set it as a homepage and you’ve got a few hundred hits from supporters every single day. This has resulted in distrowatch causing, rather than indicating, a decent chunk of popularity; People like me looking to take a dip into the FLOSS pool just pick the top name on the list, or whatever they’ve heard people scream about.

Something like distrowatch is not sufficiently large to be a good metric for comparison when this kind of loyalty exists anywhere in the linux community, from anyone.

Anonymo

this is just plain sad. you guys have too much time on your hands, you would probably find something similar if you searched the whole ubuntu forum database, so don’t tell me that it has NEVER happened as I just don’t believe it hasn’t. You get idiots in all walks of life and in every distro, once it’s found its took off, whats your problem.

Get a life, grow up, learn to code and put your time to making a distro better.

If this kind of thing carry’s on I swear i’ll go buy vista out of protest and tell everyone to do the same, new commers take on linux when I mention it to them is that it is full of scholl children fighting.

Someone is tring to put fences up, MS can’t outcode us, can’t out perform us, can’t sue us so whats left, start an internal war and watch them eat each other alive.

Paul

Up here in the Pacific Northwest, we’ve laid plenty of traps for the Penguins to gnaw their own arms off in order to get out of. So, your latest infighting is whether or not you have a Texas Penguin or a South African Penguin? We don’t even have to throw your dirty birds out of our MSWindows to show you that Penguins don’t fly. I’m gonna send this URL to everybody on my Kontact list.

Roots in Debian? Roots in Mandriva? God Almighty! Even the "Linux-Lovers" will rip apart if it means they get more blog page-hits. Just go here: http://n.ethz.ch/student/mkos/pinguin.swf if you wanna help us bash Linux.

DistroWatch or Google as a valid barometer? No wonder your Old Mens OS is a distant third. You may as well check if PCLinux or Ubuntu has as many videos or page views on their YouTube.com fanboy numbers; that would prob be more accurate and just as scientific as those nerd sites and their esoteric surveys.

Heres a clue: There are not too many distros for young people, only Old Farts think that. There once was, when you had to install everything. Nowadays the "LiveCD" has delivered you from all that partitioning and installation and young tinkerers can trade them like baseball cards.

Heres a clue: People who work for a living and kids in school don’t care about whether their OS has a Texas/Mandriva Mommy or a African/Debian Daddy. Little Timmy just wants to play KHangman, Jenny wants look up the 1st Amendment on WikiPedia while hiding Kopete in a back window, and Grandpa is playing Frozen Bubble on Level 60.

Heres a clue: standout names like Ubuntu, Mandriva, and Tupac are not something that you hear everyday; yet at least one of them has been dead for a while. PCLinuxOS is a too-plain, corny name and PCLOS is a dumb acronym. Thats why either people don’t remember the name, but most people just call that particular distro "Linux" when they’re telling someone about it; trying to describe its spinning-cube, KDE Beryl NVidia sweetness.

From the looks of some of these blogs on devisive topics with buzz-word hyperbole headlines, PCLinux isn’t the only one concerned with page hits. Linux will be broken up into factions long before M$ will, and according to most judges, M$ is an illegal monopoly. Divide, and conquer... Now, if we could only get a Granny Smith or Red Delicious distro/faction/clique to help us bring down Macintosh OS.

Balmers KNotes

When I hear of Geeks trying to do Voo-Doo arithmetic by putting names in Google, it makes me sad. I don’t have to do a virtual search. I don’t have to look far, either.

Ever heard of Edubuntu? Me, too; but the multi-district accelerated-learning ACE classroom that I know of uses Windows on half and PCLOS on the other half. They simply won’t renew the Windows license by attrition.

Ever heard of the Christian Ubuntu? Yeah , Well, the Baptist churches’ computer room down the street uses PCLOS exclusively. The same goes for the Boy Scouts computer room; PCLOS only.

See, its not just not-for-profit orgs that don’t want to pay licen$ure fees o Redmond. I know of a few teenagers who visited MySpace one too many times and caught too many bugs for their Windows to work. Those kids are now using PCLOS and don’t have their root password; Daddy does.

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THE OTHER POSTERS that this demographic has been ignored or THEY have ignored Geekfests like DistroWatch. They only way for them to do a Nerd survey is to put said survey on FaceBook, YouTube, or a family geneology website.

THESE FOLKS DON’T EVEN call the OS PCLOS, they call it "Linux" or "The Computer". They have never heard of DistroWatch, OS Surveys, or Gnome. They do not go down to the Church and search out PCLinux or Ubuntu on friggin’ Google, and you know that. They’re down there downloading Gospel w/ FrostWire for Choir practice, or using OOo to get the newsletter out.

PCLOS works right out of the box; even for the quarterback of the football team and the Capt of the cheerleading squad. You simply don’t have to know how to use a terminal to use, and/or love PCLinux. Why does that make you guys so angry?

zakoz

After being a Winblows user for a decade or so, I decided to check out Linux. Now, three years and about 80 distros later (Including Ubuntu), I find that PCLinuxOS is the most stable flavor of Linux that I have tried so far. It just works!

I also believe that different OS’s are useful for different applications. I still use the "other" proprietary operating system for certain things. My university, for example, requires me to use M$ Accounting Software. This program cannot be run under any other operating system. Another example: for my business I run a Win Server (mainly for .Net functionality and stability).

As much as I like PCLinuxOS, I refuse to participate in silly little polls that carry the potential to be tainted (like the U.S. election process). The polls don’t mean ANYTHING. Use what you like. Don’t divide the Linux community; that is exactly what M$ likes to see.

super-coder

Get a grip. Everyone knows that PCLOS fanboys are inflating distrowatch.

Desktop linux surveys show that there are more mandriva users than PCLOS users. This is confirmed by the Lenovo linux survey as well.

If TEX wanted to really improve linux. he would merge with mandriva. These 1 man distros are nothing but pure ego-stroking hubris.

Etch_user

Monkey see, Monkey do over at PCLos forums! :-)

Author Topic: 2006 Desktop Linux Market survey (Read 3433 times)
salman
2006 Desktop Linux Market survey
« on: August 23, 2006, 06:35:34 PM »

2006 Desktop Linux Market survey from desktoplinux.com: http://www.desktoplinux.com/cgi-bin/survey/survey.cgi?id=0821200617613
GO! Vote it!
[...]
texstar
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 3162
Re: 2006 Desktop Linux Market survey
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2006, 06:37:45 PM »
I voted! Grin
[....]
Linux_Fanboy
Guest
Re: 2006 Desktop Linux Market survey
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2006, 08:21:34 PM »

Quote from: texstar on August 23, 2006, 06:37:45 PM
I voted! Grin

So did I. Smiley

http://www.pclinuxos.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=58&topic=9233.msg70443#msg70443

------------------

What can you say? They teach them to VOTE when they are very young over there in Texas/PCLos country! YeeHah....:-)

Observer

Devnet, your cheap LIES HAVE SHORT LEGS! :-)

".....Sorry my friend...you’ll never get that in PCLinuxOS Forums. It’s against the rules to post links to any popularity polls...that included the recent DesktopLinux poll. Those posts are removed the moment a moderator or admin finds it per Texstar’s policy.

How do I know? I’m an admin over at pclinuxos.com :) You’ll never see it happen...."

This is a link for the post below where Devnet’s lies are completely exposed!
http://www.pclinuxos.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=58&topic=14219.30

Shame on you for being such a cheap propagandist!

Dell Linux Market Survey... does it mean something?
« on: March 18, 2007, 07:53:49 PM »

http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2007/03/13/7985.aspx

They have a whole survey and everything... of course, I voted other for distribution and picked PCLinuxOS. Come on guys, let’s vote one more time! This one can change the future!
[....]
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2007, 09:58:48 PM »
I think I have voted about 8 times, all for pclos of course. Plan on voting about 10 more times before the 23rd. It looks like that is the date the survey ends.
http://www.pclinuxos.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=58&topic=19807.0
----------
Topic: Is PCLinuxOS your Distribution of the Year? (Read 2160 times)
devnet
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Is PCLinuxOS your Distribution of the Year?
« on: January 02, 2007, 10:32:30 AM »

http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/forumdisplay.php?f=76

If you think PCLinuxOS is the best distribution of 2006, make sure you vote for it in the LinuxQuestions.org 2006 Member’s Choice Poll. There are many other areas for voting as well.

Enjoy!

PS: Don’t forget to vote for your favorite LiveCD of the year as well! Oddly, my favorite liveCD and distribution matched Wink

texstar
Administrator
Re: Is PCLinuxOS your Distribution of the Year?
« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2007, 11:19:22 PM »

Quote from: YouCanToo on January 02, 2007, 10:59:36 PM
Hope it is not like when one votes for president here in the US Shocked

Let’s not go there please. Shocked

-----------------------------------

Even the main man is at least aware of this call up to vote!

A couple examples of PCLosers in organised voting action:

"....URGENT!!!! Go ZDNet now and vote for Adrian K-H to test PCLinuxOS!!!
« on: March 05, 2007, 08:23:58 AM »

http://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/?p=298

Adrian Kingsley-Hughes at ZDNet is taking a vote on what flavour of Linux he should sample. Get yourself over there NOW and vote. Do whatever it takes to make him choose PCLOS. This is a chance to get noticed. I’m sure Ubuntu users are moving the goalposts and using multiple IP addresses to force a result.
[...]
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2007, 08:31:02 AM »
PCLinuxOS is at 7%. Ubuntu is at 48%. We have a way to go in order to pass them, but we can do it, if we do the voting.
[...]
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2007, 09:44:01 AM »
I voted.
11% now.
This forum membership is 6000. we must be able to win that poll!
[....]
« Reply #87 on: April 26, 2007, 02:06:08 PM »
Voted
1. Ubuntu (38%)
2. PCLinuxOS (23%)
Get voting guys.
[...]
« Reply #75 on: March 13, 2007, 11:23:44 AM »
as of this post were at #2
i got a bunch of computers so i might get away with a few more votes, but thats kinda cheating
[....]
« Reply #76 on: March 13, 2007, 07:28:00 PM »
[...]
pffft...all’s fair in love and war [of distros]
[...]
http://www.pclinuxos.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=58&topic=18499.0

I found it quite entertaining to read this thread! hehe :-)

@ devnel AKA Thanks!

Of course they were removed as we can no longer see them... but.... they were there and I was just responding to your message earlier as well as backing up what I said in my original post. That post was on the pclinuxos.com forums for at least 5 days too.

Now does anyone have links to other so called "Polls" that reflect popularity of a certain Linux Distro?

I should go and put my vote in... :)

Also to note I like the movement of SabayonLinux on Distrowatch. There’s a distro worth looking at...

jips

jips

@jips

As I said, the thread was removed when found by moderators and administrators.

There was more than one thread posted and all were removed. Thanks for solidifying my point...we can’t prevent users from posting stuff like this but we can remove it when we find it...which is the policy at pclinuxos.com :) As most moderators are stateside we sometimes miss things posted in the overnight hour but I can guarantee that they are removed ASAP.

Thanks!

@ Archie
@ devnel

The webmaster at reviewlinux.com was kind enough to help backup the ubuntu forum post that says pclinuxos.com forums were announcing from a poster to get out the vote and go to reviewlinux.com. Below you will see the webmasters logs from his CMS software and how it logs the referring url. The webmaster just said that these were a small sample of the many links coming from this post that has disappeared from pclinuxos.com forums

19,2,2007,’208.100.193.119’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0
20,2,2007,’69.30.181.68’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0
20,2,2007,’209.214.44.180’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0
24,2,2007,’86.41.215.76’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0
20,2,2007,’216.25.190.53’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0
20,2,2007,’71.38.158.105’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0
20,2,2007,’80.229.239.122’,’http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?topic=12499.0

Shows date ip and referring url

jips

jips here..

Go here

http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-366327.html

This thread talks about the "Get out and Vote" objective done by PCLinuxOS.Com forums Users. The poster didnt do link correctly but did talk about the many replies that were happening. Maybe this post was removed but it did exist as I saw it.. It was a play by play of watching the vote counter go up at reviewlinux.com for PCLinuxPS.. :) It happened.. :)

All my 2 cents was saying that an organized group can very easily manipulate any poll vote clicks on baners and/or page counts.. to reflect whatever they want.

I am in no way saying anything negative about PCLinuxOS but just sharing my thoughts on how polls and page counters can basically show a untrue measure of popularity.. :)

jips

@jips

I use PCLinuxOS and have been a member of its forum for a couple of years now. There are instances that I would vote on those silly polls - just for the heck of it. But NEVER were they posted on the forum; they were kinda like just stumbled upon like this one. I’m sure that even you cannot deny the fact that we, PCLinuxOS users can browse the net as well.

Tex is a good fellow and he tells us not to bash other distros. I’ve used Ubuntu 5.04 for six months but for me PCLinuxOS is just better. Use Ubuntu if it’s better for you. But don’t start a divide between our two communities. That is what’s bad for Linux.

Archie

Hi. I just tried a google trends search of sam (a derivative of
pclinuxos) and sam. Sam came out way above pclinuxos. So I don’t
know whether google trends can prove much.

Terry

Does it really matter that distro A is more popular than distro B,C and D? Shouldn’t we be focusing on getting Linux to be popular and a household name rather than bickering with this sort of schoolyard nonsense? If we all put our petty fanboyism’s aside and championed Linux as a whole people would take us seriously. We are getting there, Dell, Levono and Acer now offer Linux installed equipment not to mention all the servers out there. Please let’s not have these kind of useless debates that Windows fanboys use as weapons to show that our growing community is just a petty squabbling bunch of spotty anoraks.

My 2 pennies worth...

EmyrB

Maybe Ubuntu user are looking for another distro, and they accessed in mass the PCLOS page on distrowatch.

speedygeo

@jips

Sorry my friend...you’ll never get that in PCLinuxOS Forums. It’s against the rules to post links to any popularity polls...that included the recent DesktopLinux poll. Those posts are removed the moment a moderator or admin finds it per Texstar’s policy.

How do I know? I’m an admin over at pclinuxos.com :) You’ll never see it happen.

"Whereas a steady and confident Ubuntu user could care less about adding his/her vote to a poll."

Nice attempt at generalizing. I’m afraid this is the same for all distros though...not just Ubuntu specific ones. This assumption is based on my experience with Linux communities for 12 years now.

BTW, please don’t accuse or insinuate that distros are doing this when you have no proof that they are.

devnet

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